[DEBATE] : Jews and power in the US

[Mandi Smallhorne]

Since the original blog is predicated on an article by Mark Weber of the
Institute for Historical Review, it is important to ask who this Institute
is, what its purpose is, and so on. Wikipedia often provides convenient
short, snippable summaries and links which enable users to dig deeper into a
subject (and by the way, if you looked at the 'snippet' that Hein posted,
you will see the references which on Wikipedia you could easily look up for
yourself - those bracketed numbers, y'know, 2][3][4][5]). 
However, anybody, including the author of the Thought Leader blog, could
simply google the Institute itself to get a taste of what it is. It's a
disgusting little collation of conspiracy theory and bigotry, punting books
by people like Pat Buchanan, lectures by David Irving, and so on. If you
want to explore the mechanics of power in the USA or the world, this
Institute is a very bad place to start.
If you want to know more about the antics of the Institute itself, however,
this would be an excellent place to start:
http://www.adl.org/learn/ext_us/historical_review.asp?LEARN_Cat=Extremism&LE
ARN_SubCat=Extremism_in_America&xpicked=3&item=ihr
I find it ironic that any South African would base a blog on the writings of
a man (Mark Weber) who is a white supremacist and once said in an interview:
"l'm concerned about the future of (the white) race and I'm concerned about
the future of our country." He also warned against America's becoming "a
sort of Mexicanized, Puerto Ricanized country.... I don't believe it's
possible for Black Americans to be assimilated into white society."
Bit snippy to complain about Hein using Wikipedia as a quick summary, when
Sentletse Diakanyo didn't even bother, obviously, to make the very, very
cursory kind of search I've just done to figure out the credibility of the
article he quotes - I mean, given what I've turned up about Weber, I'd like
to know what the source of this info is: "Mark Weber also wrote that, 'The
role and influence of Jews in American politics is equally marked. Jews are
only 2% of the nation's population, yet comprise 11% of what this study
defines as the nation's elite. However, Jews constitute more than 25% of the
elite journalists and publishers, more than 17% of the leaders of important
voluntary and public interest organisations, and more than 15% of the top
ranking civil servants.'"
How come Hein, quoting Wikipedia, is an object of derision, and Sentletse
Diakanyo, quoting Mark Weber, isn't?
Mandi


-----Original Message-----
From: Dominic Tweedie [mailto:dominic.tweedie at gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, February 12, 2009 2:10 PM
To: debate: SA discussion list
Subject: Re: [DEBATE] : Jews and power in the US

WTFW? (What the effing Wiki?)

Since when has Wikipedia been an adequate authority for denouncing
people in this way? Wikipedia is a voluntary collaboration of an
unlimited group of people. If it starts to be the source of authority
for denunciations, it is probably done for, and that would be a big
shame.

Even if not for all that, since when has it been o.k. to use
"snippets", from anywhere, that go "Critics have accused..." and
"assert" and "It has been described"? Denunciation in the passive
voice is repulsive, no matter what is at stake. There is no excuse for
it.

The trouble with this type of thing, Cde Hein, is that you give a very
strong impression of sharp practice, and that is not helping us. It
may possibly be true that the Institute referred to, which one has not
otherwise heard of, is a "holocaust denial organisation", but you have
not shown us any reason to believe it. Rather to the contrary. You
protest too much. You are over the top.

I'm with Cde Azwell on this, at least until there is a bit less of a
"lobby" bearing down on him, and a bit more awareness shown of the
very large amount of discussion that has gone on, and continues to go
on, not least in the United States itself, about the political
relations between the USA and Israel, and how they work out in
practice.

So stop trying to bust a bloodvessel and get back into earth orbit,
comrade, please.

Hugs, Azwell,

Domza, VC.


2009/2/12 Hein Marais <hein at marais.as>
>
> WTF??
>
> Since when does this drivel get posted on Debate?
>
> For those interested, here's a snippet from what Wikipedia has to say
about the Institute for Historical Review:
>
> The Institute for Historical Review (IHR), founded in 1978, is an American
Holocaust denial[1] organization that describes itself as a "public-interest
educational, research and publishing center dedicated to promoting greater
public awareness of history." Critics have accused it of being an
antisemitic "pseudo-academic body" with links to neo-Nazi organizations, and
assert that its primary focus is denying key facts of Nazism and the
genocide of Jews and others.[2][3][4][5] It has been described as the
"world's leading Holocaust denial organization."[6] [7] IHR published the
non-peer-reviewed Journal of Historical Review.
>