[DEBATE] : Re: (Fwd) 'SA is subimperialist'
pbond at mail.ngo.za
Fri Nov 24 06:07:27 GMT 2006
Peter Waterman wrote:
> I note that the ILRIG, etc, roundtable exchange takes place entirely
> the parameters of classical Marxism and, in particular, of its
> In so far as we are now experiencing a different phase and type of
> capitalism from those of Marx, Rosa, Lenin or Trotsky, and in so far as
> 'critical globalisation' theories have questioned the adequacy of
> Marxist imperialist theory, I was wondering whether it was not either
> possible or necessary to consider South Africa's role in such terms.
Ok, and what would you recommend?
Here's my quick/dirty report-back to our CCS folk:
* Yesterday in CT, Dennis and I had two rip-roaring debates, first with
Ronald Suresh Roberts - who did jujitsu by invoking Cecil Rhodes as a
hustler (implying that the genuine anti-imperialist Mbeki is
successfully following in this tradition by pragmatically ripping off
the North - hah) and by asking whether the NY courts were the right
venue for the apartheid-reparations lawsuit that Dennis and I support (a
fair point but hey, if SA courts had any vehicles like the Alien Tort
Claims Act then there would be no problem) and by trying to insist
Chavez is far more conservative than Mbeki by citing welfare statistics;
and then with Shawn, Mzi and others from Ilrig and other comrades like
Althea, who were most evocative in updating and applying the ideas of
Lenin (from his great work Imperialism), against my Luxemburgist reading
of North-South and capitalist/noncapitalist power relations. Very good
information was exchanged, along the lines already circulated - even if
we cannot really say that much was concluded from the standpoint of
strategic implications. After all, imperialism or subimperialism may
just boil down to semantics - though Mthetho from Ilrig said, wisely,
that we both are referring to a 'minor imperialism'...
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