[DEBATE] : Re: Rape & the Men on this List

[Peter Mahlangu]

Mandi: However, if in one year 2000 complaints of
hijacking were made, and only 140 convictions, would
you believe that the remaining 1860 hijacking
compliants were false - or would you be complaining
like stink that the justice system was not working?
I think the latter.

Peter: I would want to know the reasons for the low
conviction rate. Speculating, I would say a fair
number of the hijackings might have been fake, with
the aim of defrauding insurance compnaies. Perhaps
there's insufficient evidence, or incompetent
detective work, resulting in weak cases. But a proper
investigation will need to be done to ascertain the
cause of the disparity between the number of
complaints versus convictions.


--- Mandi Smallhorne <mandiwrite at icon.co.za> wrote:

> I would be quite comfortable with the identitiy of
> the accused being kept
> from the media, you know, and have never said
> anything to the contrary. You
> get me wrong if you think that I wish to see the
> legal system biased in
> favour of the complainant. I only want fair
> treatment - and despite what you
> appear to believe, Peter, it is overwhelmingly
> skewed against the
> complainant.
> There is no, repeat no elision of rape complaints
> and actual rape - stats
> given always report on rape complaints, not on
> rapes. However, if in one
> year 2000 complaints of hijacking were made, and
> only 140 convictions, would
> you believe that the remaining 1860 hijacking
> compliants were false - or
> would you be complaining like stink that the justice
> system was not working?
> I think the latter.
> Mandi
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Peter Mahlangu" <tshankimahlangu at yahoo.com>
> To: <debate at lists.kabissa.org>
> Sent: Monday, April 24, 2006 11:07 AM
> Subject: [DEBATE] : Re: Rape & the Men on this List
> 
> 
> Mandi: "the bigoted crap you refer to is coming from
> someone who is not only well educated, but educated
> in
> an area that would include, one would think, some
> basic
> education in human rights, the constitution, and the
> meaning thereof".
> 
> Peter: I did not receive "basic", but advanced
> education on human rights and the constitution. My
> reading of this constution tells me that it is
> grossly
> unfair to protect the identity of a 31 year-old
> complainant in rape cases, but publish the identity
> of
> the accused. The same constitution tells me that a
> rape complaint to the police is not proof of actual
> rape (a distinction that is blurred in official
> statistics). This constitution also tells me that it
> is rubbish, and plainly unfair, to demand "No bail"
> for persons accused of rape, a favourite tactic of
> the
> POWA's of this world.
> 
> 
> --- Mandi Smallhorne <mandiwrite at icon.co.za> wrote:
> 
> > It exhausts me, too, to read this stuff; but
> > consider this: the bigoted crap
> > you refer to is coming from someone who is not
> only
> > well educated, but
> > educated in an area that would include, one would
> > think, some basic
> > education in human rights, the constitution, and
> the
> > meaning thereof. Yes, I
> > suspect that he may well be pushing buttons for
> the
> > fun of it, but even if
> > he is, I think it's worth ventilating some of
> these
> > things...
> > I have met enough men whom I like and admire,
> whose
> > intellectual capacity
> > and sensitisation to all sorts of issues is
> > undeniable, yet who have never
> > really paid attention to women's rights issues and
> > utter the same sort of
> > unthinking, rather patronising messages as we can
> > remember some
> > left-of-centre whites doing during apartheid
> years,
> > to believe that women's
> > rights issues are in dire need of explication.
> Even
> > on this list.
> > Mandi
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Charlene Smith" <clsmith at global.co.za>
> > To: <rangreen at sn.apc.org>; "debate: SA discussion
> > list "
> > <debate at lists.kabissa.org>
> > Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 4:25 PM
> > Subject: [DEBATE] : Re: Rape & the Men on this
> List
> >
> >
> > > Yes
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Ran Greenstein" <rangreen at sn.apc.org>
> > > To: <debate at lists.kabissa.org>
> > > Sent: Friday, April 21, 2006 4:22 PM
> > > Subject: [DEBATE] : Re: Rape & the Men on this
> > List
> > >
> > >
> > > On 21 Apr 2006 at 16:07, Charlene Smith wrote:
> > >
> > > > solutions lie within each one of us. At least
> > Peter is battling with
> > > > the issues, he takes the risk to expose
> himself
> > and his attitudes and
> > > > through it we get some fascinating and useful
> > debate. I mourn, that
> > > > other men lack his courage.
> > >
> > > The courage to send bigoted crap message? All
> you
> > need is the ability to
> > > press
> > > a few buttons. Would anyone here tolerate
> messages
> > that claim that the
> > main
> > > problem in SA today is that black people make
> > false accusations about
> > having
> > > been oppressed under apartheid? Or that the main
> > problem with the SA
> > > economy is that people pretend to be poor so
> that
> > they would receive
> > social
> > > grants and not have to work?
> > >
> > > No doubt there are many people in society at
> large
> > who believe just that,
> > > and
> > > also many who believe that the victims of gender
> > violence are men falsely
> > > accused of rape, and it is important to debate
> > them, but is it important
> > to
> > > do it
> > > here, on this list?
> > >
> > >
> > > Ran Greenstein
> > > Johannesburg, South Africa
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > DEBATE mailing list
> > > DEBATE at lists.kabissa.org
> > > http://lists.kabissa.org/mailman/listinfo/debate
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > DEBATE mailing list
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> >
> 
> 
> 
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